You might also try this site:

http://www.enoserv.com/index.php
apprenticerelaytech (Electrical)

6 Jun 06 0:42

We just recently (in the past year) bought a couple Omicron test sets and everybody loves them.
We had been using the Doble 2000 series test sets and have found the Omicron to be a great
upgrade. As Milliamp suggested Enoserv supplies a great program for testing relays. We have it
for both the Doble and Omicron and it works great with both test sets.
DanDel (Electrical)

6 Jun 06 10:14

My relay guy swears by the Doble 5160 with the Enoserve RTS software. My understanding is
that ProTest sfotware is good, also.
subtech (Electrical)

6 Jun 06 20:15

Where I am currently employed, Enoserv's testing software has been used for several years
now. I can say without hesitation that their software is great, the service and support is even
better. You won't deal with more friendly and relay savvy people. I've tried to use Protest and
while I wouldn't say it's bad, I definately like Enoserv's RTS better. Where I work, we've
recently upgraded to a premium version of RTS that let's use develop our own testing
routines. It isn't difficult to do, and you can build just about whatever routine you like and test a
relay immediately. I highly recommend RTS. I have seen RTS used with Doble and Manta test
sets and it works very well with either.
GermanPat (Electrical)

7 Jun 06 6:08

Two years ago we bought a relay test equipment from Kocos. My colleagues and me are very
happy with it. We are a small service group located in Germany and we do all kind of tests on
different types of relays. I do not have experiences with the Doble or Megger devices because
they are not very common here in Germany. Here we only have two main suppliers of relay test
devices, Omicron and Kocos. So we had the choise between these two parties. We got a demo
from both of them and we finally went for the +.
Maybe this company is an alternative for you. For us it is.
mikey70 (Electrical)

10 Jun 06 10:56

Check the Manta 5000. Only new set on the market that can run from the front panel. Designed
by a relay tester, not some software geek who never saw a relay. Doble and Omicron very good
test sets as well. I like RTS for software.
PapaMike (Electrical)

12 Jun 06 9:48

Hello,
I am working for a service group in finland. Three years ago we have been infront of the same
decision. After a look on the Doble, KoCoS and Omicron we've decided for an ARTES 440 II.
Main sticking points for us were the good support, the options of the device and the price (as
always).
PhilGavin (Electrical)

23 Jun 06 18:34

In terms of hardware, I'd be looking for 6 current sources, (the higher the compliance voltage
the better) and minimum of four voltages.
Binary inputs should double as oscillographic measuring channels.
In this regard I believe the Doble F6150 pips the CMC 256-6.
However with regards to software, the Omicron test universe Ver.2 is streets ahead of Pro-test.
Omicron seems to maintain an innovative position one step ahead of the rest.
I do not know another test set that can import all electronic settings from any IED, manipulate
these settings to test parameters and automatically populate test plans on an equal with the
Omicron.
I believe GE Programma have are aiming for this too.
I am not familiar with the RTS package.
However, you may want to consider these guys.
They are new kids on the block that have an interesting market offering as a open test kit
solution.
http://www.ips-energy.com/en/
They claim to be able to represent any relay information in an importable IEC 61850 format.
This manipulation is performed automatically for electronic settings.
By all account it covers all the database angles covered by RTS too.
In the near future all test kit manufacturers will have to make their test kits fluent in the IEC
61850 protocol, as this will be a require to converse with the majority of modern relays.

DTR2011 (Electrical)

13 Oct 06 9:19

I have used Doble, Megger (AVO), Manta, Programma and Omicron at various service
companies over the past years. What impressed me most was that in the Omicron demo, the guy
picked up the test set and dropped it on the table before doing the demo.
The Manta I used was state of the art at the time (10 yrs ago). Havent used the new one.
Our Pulsar spent a lot of time in the repair shop, or being dropped in order to get it to work.
Programma does not have the power for US 5 amp relays.

On the Software side, Omicron is clearly the best. In the service world, one does not get paid
until the report is submitted. The ability to make a nice report automatically and quickly is a
clear plus. Omicron does a nice job. Protest is very poor at this, as is Manta and Programma.
Some people quip about computer controlled or not. Perhaps if all relays were mechanical that
would be a rational response, but in my experience, one would be a fool in trying to test a SEL,
Basler, ABB, or GE without talking to the relay during the test. Then of course there is the
documentation.
Some utilities have minimal documentation, such as relay test cards. Not in the private world.
I like to have the ability to modify the test plans easily. Multifunction relays can be 1-100
different functions.
oldfieldguy (Electrical)

13 Oct 06 10:11

smallgreek-You're pointing to a real problem among field engineers for service companies. We had to test
a wide variety of relays. Working for several clients, we'd find one who was a Schweitzer fan,
another who'd bought GE Multilin, a third who liked Basler.
Software just to communicate with the devices was a problem, as was manuals. Manuals on CD
definitely help this problem.
But it is really an exercise to have to look at each application of a multifunction relay and
decide which functions to test and how to test them.
old field guy
DTR2011 (Electrical)

13 Oct 06 10:26

old field guy

I agree. It was bad enough in the past to have to carry along several milk crates filled with the
IBs for just the GE & West Relays. At least there were certain things that could be memorized
such as 1,10, 7,8 on a CO.
A SEL, GE or Basler manual are often 2-300 pgs long. Many of the new manuals do not even
give testing procedures. Keeping up on the SW for all these relays. Being able to buy a laptop
computer with an RS-232 serial port.
Worst part is that many people are straying away from some kind of test switch at all on the
digital relays, or if they do have them, the voltages are in the wrong place, etc. And drawings,
settings.....
I guess the good thing is that with the proliferation of new relays, there still remains a demand

for qualified relay people after all.

Good luck.
(2)

521AB (Electrical)

13 Oct 06 12:06

According to my personal experience:

Omicron (www.omicron.com) CMC256-6 is ready for IEC61850.
They have ethernet port, they can trip by GOOSE messages instead of binary inputs, they are
able to import SCD files etc.
They have the new XRIO concept to draw characteristics for a lot of relays (without need to
import the RIO files, characteristic is generated by the XRIO itself). They can test in primary or
secondary quantities.
Software is easy to use (you do need some practice).
Performances are more than enough for testing numerical relays.
Very good Comtrade Viewer.
ISA (www.isatest.com) DRTS-6: no ethernet port (yet?). Only RS232 or USB.
Some parts of the software are very good and easy to use.
Very good export of test data, in Microsoft DataBase format. Easy to elaborate them with Excel.
Possibility to test in primary and/or secondary quantities.
Similar concept to Omicron XRIO: a library of functions that draw relay characteristics (mainly
distance protection) for the different relays.
Sometimes tricky software (sequences), but usually well running and easy to use (easier than
Omicron).
Doble (www.doble.com). Software was not easy to use, now it is better but still it looks like
glued on the old software. Anyway much better than before. In my opinion much less user
friendly then Omicron and/or ISA.
They do have ethernet interface, not ready for IEC61850 but as far as I know they will come
soon with it.
Hardware is superior to the other 2, but you appreciate it only while testing elechtromechanical
relays. For numerical relays there is no clear advantage.
General Electric - Programma (Freja 300).
(http://www.ge.com/de/downloads/FREJA_300_English.pdf)
When (or if) are 6 current generators coming?
Still RS232 port?
What about ethernet interface?
Software is very easy to use but the performances are also limited. Quite slow in testing
distance protections.

DTR2011 (Electrical)

19 Oct 06 20:02

Beware of one thing when expecting a database of relays.

For the old electromechanical relays you can find such databases. For a digital relay, there are
so many available settings that even if the relay is in the data base, the functions that you need
to test may not be part of the test template.
I would advise that the testing SW be flexible and have test modules that are dedicated for the
protection type you are testing (overcurrent, diff, distance, etc).
By the way, Doble does not support analog input for osc. viewing.
SHR1969 (Electrical)

6 Nov 06 9:46

Sorry to hear about your disappointing review of the MPRT from Megger. I do not know what
you got to see, but the MPRT comes with the AVTS V2.0 software. The software includes test
files for about 57 different relays by 5 different relay manufacturers. Most of those test files are
for electromechanical relays, like CO's, IAC's, BDD, etc. There are are several microprocessor
based relays from ABB and SEL, and a half dozen solid-state relays from Basler that are
included. More importantly, if you are a registered AVTS user on the extended support you
have access to the Megger website AVTS users forum. There you will find additional test files
for about 90 other relays, including numerous microrprocessor based relays like the SEL-311,
SEL-501 just to name a couple. Many have been posted by the AVTS users, and others have
been posted by several of the Megger Applications Engineers.
thebqe (Electrical)

22 Nov 06 10:01

I'm a relay engineer in the corporate office and we use the Omicron 256-6 to "sanity check" our
settings for mostly microprocessor relays before sending them to the sites. One site uses Pulsar
and had difficulty confirming our tests. As others have mentioned, the Omi has prebuilt xrio test
files available for many relays. I used one of these to verify performance of a Siemens
transformer diff relay and it produced a beautiful report with user friendly output showing
"Pass" (and "Fails") on earlier tries. That site is pushing to get Omicrons. They have so many
software tools on their Omicron Universe software
00123456 (Electrical)

13 Mar 07 6:02

Kamin Dave (Electrical)

I am Relay Engineer & i have used OMICRON CMC256-6, FREJA300 & DOBLE F6150. I
have analyze some points as listed below;
1) CMC256-6 is very good to test for Static, numerical & digital relays not for whole scheme.
2) F6150 is very to test for electromechanical, static & numerical relays & schemes.
3) FREJA300 is quite good to test only for numerical relays.
4) Omicron Test universe software is much more better than Doble F6TEST software &
FREJAWIN software is nuch more easier than Test Universe software.
5) Front Panel control is only available in FREJA300.

6) FREJA300 is semi-automatic relay testing kit. CMC256-6 & F6150 are used as fully
automatic relay testing instrument.
7) Graphical lookout of ProTesT software is not very good but, it is more flexible & fast than
others.
8) Application of ProTesT software is very useful for generator protections as well as motor
protection relays because we can able to program & calculate somany parameters in software.

00123456 (Electrical)

13 Mar 07 6:30

Hi Kamin Dave
I am contd. with above points;
9) Relay testing is very easy with CMC256-6 & F6150 because Omicron is providing RIO files
library with TESTUNIVERSE SOFTWARE for testing of various relays & Doble is also
providing very good relay library with F6TEST & PROTEST SOFTWARES including RIO
IMPORT facility. But, it is very difficult to test some special characteristics with FREJA300.
FRAJAWIN SOFTWARE is also having RIO IMPORT facility, but characteristic creation is
difficult than F6TEST & TESTUNIVERSE.
10) IEC61850 feature is available in F6150 & CMC256-6, but it is not in FREJA300.
11) Some of the special features like CT saturation waveform for differential relay testing,
Power system model for dynamic testing, Power swing creation (Asynchronous method &
DZ/DT Method), Inrush gap creation for static differential relay testing etc. available in
softwatre & it is possible to Create & test with F6150 & CMC256-6 but, these features are not
available in FREJAWIN software.
12) Finally, my conclusion is; harware wise F6150 is much more better than CMC256-6 &
FREJA300, but there is no doubt; TESTUNIVERSE SOFTWARE is more better than DOBLE
F6TEST SOFTWARE. CMC256-6 is having maximum 4-voltages & 6-currents channels &
F6150 is having maximum either 6-voltages & 6-currents or 12-currents channels.
avtpvt (Electrical)

16 Mar 07 8:37

DOBLE instrument is OK for electromechanical & static relay testing but, it's not clear
advantage for modern multifuction numerical relays. Omicron software is so good.
Milliamp (Electrical)

16 Mar 07 11:18

Let me throw one more kink in the rope or rock in the soup, whatever. What if you don't do
individual relay testing? What if you do system testing by playing simultaneous faults to both
ends of the line? Any thoughts?
DanDel (Electrical)

16 Mar 07 14:44

ETAP PowerStation has a ARTTS module which allows direct testing of relays and comparison
with the TCC curves in a coordination study, along with real-time monitoring of the system, to
provide feedback into the curves on the TCC graphs. It may help with your needs.
www.etap.com

lz5pl (Electrical)

18 Mar 07 17:30

I am using Freja 300. It was chosen by economical reasons mainly (we found good second hand
offer). I was disapointed with the software - it is steps beside Test Universe. It seems that after
ascuisition from GE, Programma stopped their development. Big advantage of this test set is the
possibility to operate from the front panel without PC. My guys tested in two days half of a
generator protection functions until they receive new laptop instead of the broken one!
Omicron is in my view the Mercedes of test sets. Unfortunately also pricewise! But if the price
is not so big problem, CMC256 would be my choise, probably as the Mercedes :).
ISA - DRTS6: a friend of mine is using it very intensively almost two years without any
problems. I am a bit suspicious about the quality of Italian electronics, but in this case I have
nothing to say. Software of this tester is also close to Test Universe, and upgrades are free - very
good option!. If Italians were more flexible with their offer, I would buy DRTS6 instead of
Freja300. By the way, new Freja300 costs more than new DRTS6, so if you have to choose new
one ISA should be the winner.

Regarding the simultaneous testing on both ends of the line - at least any of this 3 tester with
which I have personal experience, has GPS option to synchronize injection of two testers. Good
option, but I doubth how frequently it is used. For the moment this advantage never have been
required in my practice.
-----------------------It may be like this in theory and practice, but in real life it is completely different.
The favourite sentence of my army sergeant
00123456 (Electrical)

21 Mar 07 2:34

My reply is to Mr.MilliAmps,
Why not? It is possible to do with End-to-End Testing. These is the procedure if you can use
F6150 & CMC256-6;
Step:-1
If you can use GPS receiver annetena on both end & just synchronise both the instrument on
time.
Step:-2
Create Phase to Phase/3-ph & Phase to ground faults in STATE SIMULATION & STATE
SEQUENCE modules with the help of power system model (Single Line/Parallel line/Parallel
line with Tap etc.)
Step:-3
Apply faults from both end simultaneoulsy & see the bahivour of the scheme operations

including carrier send carrier receive signals.

It is very easy once you will do it.
Reply is to Mr.Dandel,
What you are suggeting to test with ETAP & ARTTS? Over current & earth fault relay coordinations & testing?
My understating is; that you can do with any numerical relay testing instruments. I have used
ETAP POWER STATION 2.5 version (Load flow, SC & TCC modules), it is calculating fault
currecnts on various bus based on input data. Another important thing is; ETAP/EDSA/CYME
etc. freq. domain programs whivh good for power system studies/analysis not for relay
performance testing. For relay performance testing; EMTP/ATP/PSCAD/NETOMAC softwares
are good to create transient conditions even same files (.cgf/pl4) can be used for ened to end
testing. This is only the relistic method to check the performance of Distance schemes.
In theory; there is no difference in theory & practice but in practice; there is some!!!!!!!!
Thanks
lz5pl (Electrical)

21 Mar 07 5:51

In theory; there is no difference in theory & practice but in practice; there is some!!!!!!!!
---------00123456, I see that some values are the same all over the world! This was one of the main
reasons for me to choose engineering profession - the law of Ohm is not ideologically
dependent.
Thank you for the nice explanation about end-to-end testing. When our company became rich
enough to buy two Omicrons I will use it, but now I will pray the customer not to ask for such
tests
www.triel.dir.bg
-----------------------It may be like this in theory and practice, but in real life it is completely different.
The favourite sentence of my army sergeant
00123456 (Electrical)

22 Mar 07 1:00

Iz5PL,
I can understand commercial problem, but End to End testing is also possible to do with
FREJA300 & FRAJAWIN 5.1 SOFTWARE if you have two instruments with external sync.
modules. Programma (Now, GE) is providing GPS-100 receiver that can able to generate 5V
TTL-signal on specified time.
Every thing is not a big thing, only thing, you need to just some!!!!!!!
Thanks
lz5pl (Electrical)

22 Mar 07 3:26

I am totally agree with you, 00123456, end-to-end test is the closest one to real conditions. But
until the customer doesn't ask for it, according to me it is not necessary to enter in such
complications. It is simply not economically reasonable. Of course I know that Freja also has
this feature, as well as DRTS6. But the if I will invest in second tester it will not be Freja.
Probably I will look for CMC-256 or DRTS6.
-----------------------It may be like this in theory and practice, but in real life it is completely different.
The favourite sentence of my army sergeant
00123456 (Electrical)

22 Mar 07 3:46

Iz5PL,
If you have one Freja300 + FrejaWin software & one DRTS6 + ISAWIZARD software then
also it is possible to do end to end testing for distance protection. It's 3-4 cycles difference
between FREJA300 & DRTS6 for activation of sources that time you need to enter in one of the
software.
Very simple!!!!
Thanks
lz5pl (Electrical)

22 Mar 07 8:01

Good idea, thank you!

-----------------------It may be like this in theory and practice, but in real life it is completely different.
The favourite sentence of my army sergeant
DanDel (Electrical)

26 Mar 07 9:22

The ETAP PowerStation software now has a module that allows relay testing, with direct
communication between the software performing real-time monitoring of the system and a relay
test set. Check out the website for more info.
00123456 (Electrical)

25 Apr 07 4:02

Hi,
Sorry,i am late
I know ETAP power station software is having module or option that allows relay testing, with
direct communication between software & DRT6 or ART3 (ISA make) instruments on desired
freq. sampling rates (say; 2kHz, 5kHz, 10kHz or 20kHz etc.), but again i am saying it's a ETAP
is a freq. domain program it's not a electromagnetic transient program. So, it it just creating fault
waveform including dc offset with higher sampling rates not more. same thing that you can able
to generate by using state sequence or state simulation program in relay testing softwqare.
ETAP can not able to simulate dynamic characteristics of electrical networks based like
EMTP/ATP/PSCAD-EMTDC.
i.e. suppose i want to simulate transient ground fault in series compensated lines or ungrounded

system (pi section or T-section) then EMTP/ATP & PSCAD can able to simulate fault with
electrical damping & it's effect on other two phases also but, this is not possible through
ETAP/EDSA/SKM/CYME any freq. domain prog. that why EMTP/ATP/PSCAD-EMTDC are
the best electromagnetic -transient program to simulate real time simulation for relay
development purpose.
ETAP is good for power suytem studies (i.e. short circuit, load flow, harmonic analysis, stabilty
etc.)not for relay development works or performance testing.
Thanks
00123456 (Electrical)

27 Apr 07 0:51

Hi,
I forgot to say one more thing in my earlier discussion;
ETAP, PSS/E, EUROSTAGE, SIMPOW, SKM, CYME etc. Electromechanical Transient
Programs & EMTP/ATP, PSCAD/EMTDC, NETOMAC etc. Electromegnatic Transient
Programs.
Electromechanical Transient Programs are good to study for Power system analysis (i.e. short
circuit study, Loadflow, Harmonic analysis & Transient stability etc.), but application of these
programms are very less for relay developement works.
Elecrtomegnatic Transient programms are very good for relay developement works; it can able
to generate very fast transient ground faults in ungrounded systems as well as series
compensated networs, SSRC, Ferro-resonance, Network harmonics-resonances, Switching over
voltages, Heavy capacitor inrush currents, TR magnetizing inrush currents, CVT transients and
somany things. Sampling rate is also very very then Ele-mech. Transient programms.
Thanks
lz5pl (Electrical)

27 Apr 07 13:44

Now after this long discussion about features of various numerical testers I would like to
remember a small case from my practice. 15 years ago I went on commissioning of new s/s in
Egypt and found that there is no phase shifter delivered for testing of 67/67N relays. We had
TURH - for youngsters it is electromechanical test set from Programma specially designed for
impedance relays, Sverker, lab autotransformer 250/250 V, several measuring instruments, etc.
HiTech electromechanical equipment.
Finally I "invented" my test system using: 3-phase power supply transformer 380/110 V (from
TURH set), lab autotransformer, variable rheostat, ammeter and phase angle meter. And by this
"invention" more than 50 relays were tested!
My young engineers now are probably more intelligent than me, but I really doubt whether they
could imagine this scheme. Starting directly with numerical tester creates specific way of
thinking and IMHO cuts imagination.
But please, don't ask me to test relays with this setup now!

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